It wasn't an alternate reality or anything. That was just Peggy's dream. None of them were real, so I don't see why they warrant their own pages.
It wasn't an alternate reality or anything. That was just Peggy's dream. None of them were real, so I don't see why they warrant their own pages.
I've seen this fan theory a few times. No part of this has been confirmed in canon, it is just based on various hints in some canon materials and a TV show.
Anyway, there's a theory that Johann Fennhoff was the man who "programmed" Bucky to become The Winter Soldier.
I know they used the Memory Supressing machine on Bucky, but this isn't about his memories, but rather the trigger words and the programming put into his mind.
According to the Wakanda Files book which is meant to be a series of records relating to the time when Shuri was deprogramming Bucky, The Winter Soldier's
trigger words worked in a very similar way to hypnosis, inducing him into a type of trance.
Fennhoff appears in the Agent Carter series, where it is shown that he specialized in hypnosis and was famous for being able to to put anyone into a trance. In the series, he makes a man throw himself in front of a van whilst in a trance, and tried to induce others to commit acts of violence using hyposis and mind control.
He even takes over the mind of Howard Stark and tries to use him to commit a terrorist attack on a VE day parade.
Here's the interesting thing about Fennhoff's mind control method. He controls people's minds by getting them to focus on certain memories or events in their lives.
If he wanted to calm a person down, he'd get them to focus on good memories, but if he wanted them to become aggressive or do something bad, he'd make them focus on bad memories, traumatic experiences or things they felt guilty about.
Again, from the Wakanda Files book , each of the Winter Soldier's trigger words were linked to traumatic memories or life events.
It seems that the trigger words and mind control used on Bucky just have all the hallmarks of Fennhoff's work and methods.
Also, Fennhoff had a close association with the Soviet Union and was recruited by Zola. Could it be that Zola decided to let Zola "program" the first product of his Winter Soldier project, Bucky Barnes?
what if we see bernard stark again?
i mean, the multiverse is a big thing now, what if he was snuck into a later film as an easter egg?
I've noticed many Agent Carter characters have Alive Status, which I find strange because that series takes place in the '40s, so if they were still alive, each one would be over 100 years old.
Do you think we should update their respective pages and say all of them are dead or we leave them as they are?
One day I had quite a lot of fan theories and speculation on my mind regarding things one might consider plot holes or just unanswered questions. So I decided to write them down and since I don't really have anywhere else to put them, I decided why not just have them put to the test and give to other MCU fans to see what they thought about them.
If you have any other headcanons I'd love to hear them. Now on to the speculation.
SWORD is secretive because of the Skrulls
In Agents of Shield Season 5, we get a joke nodding to SWORD, though Coulson states he isn't familiar with the organization.
At that time, it was because the rights were tied with the X-Men, and therefore the organization was with Fox. In Phase 4 not only do we learn that that SWORD was formed years ago, after the events of Captain Marvel, but by Monica's mom.
This begs the question, why wouldn't Coulson know? especially after becoming director of SHIELD. I believe that it's because SWORD's existence is not known to the public, because it was meant to avoid infiltration.
Consider this, they are both in the space travel and weapons business, and as such, would be in the interest of groups like either HYDRA or Kree.
With that in mind, Maria would've asked Skrulls for techniques on discovering infiltrators, so that the organization couldn't be brought down from the inside.
Still that doesn't mean the organization couldn't be run by incompetent people (see Wandavision) but they at least weren't seemingly affected by the Hydra Uprising.
The Hand inspired the Foot in the MCU
If you don't remember, Ms. Marvel had a nod towards the Ninja Turtles. This is kinda weird considering how Frank Miller's run on Daredevil was a major reason for the TMNT's creation, and in universe, Daredevil has existed only recently, ie. the 2010s.
One possibility is that in the MCU, the creators simply made the turtles had no influence from Miller or maybe they read an equivalent character.
But consider this, the Hand, the organization that inspired the Foot in the TMNT comics, is considerably older, and as such, could have been an urban legend or conspiracy theory like the Illuminati (the legend not the comics group). So, what if...the duo that created the Turtles took inspiration from the real life group of villains?
The Comics on She-Hulk (Earth-199999)
Remember that rack of comics on GLK&H? If we go by original comics' logic, the reason why they're there is because they are used as anecdotal evidence of events.
If that is also the case in the MCU, then does that mean that the events of these comics happened in the MCU as well? Because the covers showcase the return of Baron Strucker as an LMD (which, we've seen LMDs and Strucker before), and more interestingly Count Nefaria (whose daughter Madame Masque appeared on Agent Carter). And if we were to read the inside of the comics, there are Avengers that have yet to debut on the silver screen. Plus there's the whole question as to whether or not they were published in their original time of publication. Either that, or the comics industry really improved their drawing and writing skills exponentially.
Also worth noting that by having Agent Carter one shot for the SHIELD 50th Anniversary, which was a part of other one-shots, like those for Mockingbird and Quake, they are acknowledging the Agents of SHIELD and Marvel TV side, since, without Agent Carter, that one-shot wouldn't have happened.
The Comics of She-Hulk (on Kevin's Office and the writers' room)
It's interesting to see several comic covers and pages during the She-Hulk 4th Wall scene in the finale, especially because it has nothing to do with her ending. Still, a few couple issues are worth noting.
On the She-Hulk side, we see some from the Byrne run and some from the newest one. But one that was notable is one where she fought the Leader. Now granted it was part of a deleted plot, but who says that line from Kevin wouldn't indicate her return on Cap 4?
Additionally, we see Mark Waid's run on Daredevil represented on some columns, but one notable one is an early issue where Matt's identity goes public. Maybe an indicator of how Kingpin will ruin his life?
One final comic worth noting is the Korvac saga being there, as rumors suggested a while ago that Korvac would be featured in a future movie (The Marvels), but those have since died down. So it is curious why it is still there. Perhaps we'll see something akin to the events of the Lego Marvel 2 game where Korvac is an enforcer for Kang?
Werewolf by Night has been saving Man-Thing since 2014 or before
So, before his proper debut, Man-Thing was mentioned in Agents of SHIELD and referenced in Thor: Ragnarök. We know he's survived to this point, so the question is how is he returning. Well, we know that Jack has at least found him before once, but what if Man-Thing escaped because of Jack the last two times?
Jack could've used the chaos of the Hydra uprising to find and help save Ted from imprisonment, maybe even opening doors for other prisoners and causing a riot. And once Man-Thing found himself on Sakaar, Werewolf traveled there and fought the Grandmaster's forces to liberate Ted. Hopefully not alone, because that wouldn't be the safest.
Stark Industries owns Marvel Comics/Entertainment in the MCU
This is the most fan theoryiest of the bunch, and it has to do with something simple.
We know that good ol' Howard did try and make movies, ironically adapting western comic books, made by Timely Comics. So, it wouldn't be a stretch to think that rather than buy the licensing rights to just Kid Colt, he bought the whole of Timely Comics, and after that, its chronology stayed the same, except for maybe the whole superhero comic boom.
We know that there were also Patsy Walker comics, so maybe the industry stayed in the romance dramas for a while, and although DC did create Superman and Batman, Marvel did not. That is until Iron Man and all the new era of superheroes.
Additionally, stuff like Runaways show items based on Spider-Man, so it would seem someone has the rights to Spider-Man's likeness. The same thing can be said about the toys. We see Avengers toys on Season 1 of Agents of Shield, but it is until Ms. Marvel that we see other superheroes besides the core 6 Avengers are sold, with the Marvel logo. And since Pym Tech is no more, someone must be creating those products.
The Timeline article tells that the one-shot is set after season 2 of the tv series which is set in July of 1947
But i don't think that's correct. Can someone explain?
I just realized this firm has been around since the 1940s and is mentioned in Agent Carter, so how old is Holliway?
Unless he was a lawyer since he was a child.
I think there's a mistake about Peggy Carter biography in this wiki.
It says 'Agent Carter' (one-shot) happens after 'Agent Carter' (TV series).
But in season 2, it's obvious 1948, and in one-shot, it's 1946.
Here's the information on Wikipedia, it's more reasonable:
"One year later, Carter faces sexism from her boss, Agent John Flynn, who treats her condescendingly and keeps her compiling data and code breaking while assigning field cases to the male agents. The SSR's main concern is the mysterious Zodiac, which they have been unable to recover for some time.
One night alone in the office while the men are out together, Carter answers the case line to hear of the location of the Zodiac. Though three to five agents are recommended, Carter decides to go to the location herself. Fighting off multiple guards, Carter is able to retrieve the Zodiac, a mysterious serum, herself. The next day, Flynn reprimands her for not going through the proper procedures to complete the mission, and dismisses the indignant Carter as just an "old flame" of Captain America's who was given her current job out of pity for her bereavement. However, before he can officially punish her, the case line rings again, this time with Howard Stark on the other end, who informs Flynn that Carter will co-head the newly created S.H.I.E.L.D.
Later in 1946, Carter has to balance the routine office work she does for the SSR in New York City with secretly assisting Howard Stark, who finds himself framed for supplying deadly weapons to enemies of the United States. Carter is assisted by Stark's butler, Edwin Jarvis, to find those responsible and dispose of the weapons."
What do you guys think were going to be the Next plotlines for Agent Carter, the Netflix shows, Runaways, Cloak & Dagger, Inhumans and Helstrom before they got cancelled?
I watched alredy all MARVEL netflex and disney+ series, but didn't watch the other shows... Should I watch them?
It was so good! Second season was my favorite. But who killed agent Thompson at the end???
So there is a new book out, titled Marvel Studios: The First Ten Years: The Definitive Story Behind the Blockbuster Studio. I have seen a lot of articles about how this book confirms/implies Agent carter is canon to the MCU(as it has always been) and lefts AoS in some kind of limbo zone(most articles got on the not canon train).
One of the authors(Tara Bennett) of the book has since come out and said many articles have cherry-picked quotes and her tweet out of context to sell their narrative.
So The main purpose of this post does anyone who has the book can share the section regarding the canonicity of Marvel TV? I want to see them, compared to just reading click bait articles.
Does the Agent Carter One Shot take place before or after the TV Series? The Pages for Peggy and Howard have them after The events of the series, but the Event Timeline for 20th Century page has it before. I'm confused.
Hello there. I don't know if Marvel Television tv series ( Agents of shield, Agent carter, punisher, etc. ) consider as canon in the mcu. If they are canon, in which order should i watch them? Thanks for your answers.
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In the new marvel studios legends episode about Peggy Carter, it completely ignores the show. But it doesn’t ignore the one-shot. To me that confirms that marvel has wiped this show from the timeline, and agents of shield directly references it, leading me to believe that show is no longer canon either, and therefore neither is Inhumans or runaways.
I noticed that most places on the wiki state that the one shot occurs after the series (except in the 1940's page, which actually places the events of the one shot before). I find this odd because along with the one shot saying that it takes place one year after the first avenger, it also contradicts a lot of development that came from the series if placed after. She becomes a well respected SSR agent, and is able to move on from her relationship with Steve Rogers, at least to the point where she no longer has flashbacks of the moment he went into the ice. Along with all of this the first episode of Agent Carter shows a flashback from the one shot. I know that no matter where the one shot is placed there are going to be some inconsistencies, but I think overall the one shot makes more sense coming before the series.
A while back I started thinking about Agent Carter, and I even gave it a rewatch. I believe that Agent Carter as a show has had more of an influence in the first batch of TV shows for Disney+ than either the Netflix or the ABD/Hulu shows. Here are some of the reasons why I believe such claim.
And of course, it's on a numbered list. Leave your thoughts down below, or make your own thing like this.
1) Gives secondary characters the spotlight
While a few could point at Agent Coulson's revival in AoS as the true starter of this trend, Coulson wasn't really the protagonist, rather he shared it between the team members. On the opposite side, Peggy is the main character through and through with Jarvis being the sidekick.
2) Great things come in pairs
Following on the previous point, Agent Carter gives her someone to bounce off in the form of Jarvis. We can see that pattern continue with Vision in Wandavision, Bucky Barnes in Falcon and the Winter Soldier, and Mobius M. Mobius in Loki.
3) Retro Aesthetic
It is very obvious to see the retro aesthetic in both Loki and Wandavision, and to a lesser extent in Falcon and the Winter Soldier (with its Lethal Weapon influence). In that regard, Agent Carter's setting and costuming could be called the Beta Test for this, as they had to do period accurate costumes, buildings/interiors, and technology. Whether or not this is kept, is yet to be seen, although Ms. Marvel in the style of 2000's Disney Channel movie or Moon Knight parodying the 90's edgyiness could be interesting.
4) Consequences in Later Movies
While all Marvel TV shows never advertised themselves as impacting later movies, the current ones do. Whether or not they will impact greatly or just be an easter egg is still up in the air. Despite that, Agent Carter is one of the few to actually have crossed over. Primarily in Jarvis's cameo in Endgame, but also in smaller details such as Pinky Pinkerton's uniform in Cap's Smithsonian exhibition in Falcon and the Winter Soldier.
One could argue that the first was because Markus and McFeely worked on the show, and wanted to pay tribute to it, but the second one is harder to deny.
5) Shorter is better
Compared to other offerings which tended to go up to 13 or 22 episodes, Agent Carter limited itself to 10 in Season 2. Granted none of the current shows have gone to that length, but they've certainly been close. Not only do shorter seasons mean bigger budgets for the episodes, but also more focused storylines.
I think people should know that the Marvel Television series before Disney+, are within the same universe as the MCU. I mean basically everyone low-key confirmed it, the Russo Bros, Jeph Loeb, even Kevin Feige who said that there is an opportunity of that happening, but not yet. How come no one see that?
In Agents of Shield, literally the guy running the team is the guy who appeared from Iron Man and then in Captain Marvel. Nick Fury, Lady Sif, President Ellis, Peggy Carter, and Maria Hill all appeared in that show and they’re like “nah it’s a different character from a different universe” bruh this is literally the same character from the movies! Just because an Avenger doesn’t appear in the show, doesn’t mean it’s not canon! They even mention the events from the films like The Avengers, Iron Man 3, Thor: The Dark World, Captain America: The Winter Soldier, Age of Ultron, Ant-Man, Civil War, and Infinity War for crying out loud!
Agent Carter, gee I don’t know maybe because Peggy is the lead character and the now wife of Steve who we all know and love or the fact that Edwin Jarvis appeared in Endgame! Again, same character, same universe! Also Kevin Feige was involved in this series by the way.
Marvel Netflix Shows, there’s nothing much to say but the fact how the Battle of New York or should I say “The Incident” effected others who were there and saw destruction falling from the sky. The promo shows the Avengers tower but not in the shows, that’s because they don’t have enough budget to edit that stuff in there. They even mention the events from Agents of Shield. Also double roles are no longer an issue, Mahershala Ali played Cottonmouth and will eventually play Blade. Well guess what, Gemma Chan played Doctor Minerva and will now play as Sersi in Eternals. So how about that? The Russo Bros and Kevin really wanted to bring those guys in Infinity War but they can’t because it was impossible, they were separate at that time.
Runaways, WHIH Newsfront appeared on TV, Wakanda was mentioned, they used magic from Doctor Strange and borrowed the Darkhold from Agents of Shield and appeared in WandaVision, which is the SAME BOOK! Because it has the ability to change.
Cloak & Dagger, Stark Industries is mentioned, along with references from the Netflix shows, they even appeared in Runaways in a Crossover episode. And Roxxon appears in this and pretty much everywhere in the MCU.
Inhumans, *sigh* as much as I hate to admit it, I’m maybe okay with it being canon...for now. I just haven’t seen it. Is it even good?
If you look up and it saids Kevin Feige confirms Marvel TV shows are not canon, that isn’t fully true, you have to be very careful on what source you’re looking into. Pretty much some of these information I mentioned are on Wikipedia.
I think the reason why people don’t consider these shows non-canon is probably because A. They think it’s boring or B. It take place in a different universe. Well no, they’re canon, they’re in the same universe, whether you like it or not!