Thread:Marvelus/@comment-26838855-20190116120806/@comment-26838855-20190203163948

CirUmeUela's The Punisher: Season 2 Notes (CirUmeUela)
CirUmeUela wrote: Ok, here are my notes for Punisher Season 2: Punisher 2.04: Scar Tissue 11:22-15:26

June 2017, 6 months into Billy Russo’s recovery

Billy’s therapist Dr. Dumont talks to him about what kind of face he wants the world to see and suggests that he decorate his mask I would say that Billy's recovery begins after he woke up, not after he entered his coma. It's said that he woke up after 6 weeks, so around January 27, 2017. That would make this around ([July 27, 2017]*2+[July 16, 2017]*1)/3 = July 23, 2017.

CirUmeUela wrote: Punisher 2.04: Scar Tissue 19:48-21:16

May 2018?

Shortly before start of Season 2, Amy’s friends get killed, she runs for her life Yeah, considering she's only just reporting it to Konchevsky in Episode 1, I think it's only been a few days (enough that she's not completely constantly devastated). Konchevsky says he expected Fiona yesterday, so I would assume they were killed a couple of nights prior to when they were due to get to Konchevsky. I'll let you know the exact date once I've worked it out.

CirUmeUela wrote: Punisher 2.04: Scar Tissue 25:28-28:05

2014? <span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Frank and Billy talk about stuff at a little league baseball game Frank and Billy were in Kandahar from September 2013, so it has to be before that. I was going to say winter considering Billy's hat (clearly given to Ben Barnes to hide the fact that his head has been shaved for the present day events), but from some quick research, looks like Little League is June-August. So Summer 2013 I guess, a bit before the flashback in Memento Mori. Little League seems to be Friday, June 21st to Sunday, August 25th in 2019, so guessing roughly Friday, June 21st to Sunday, August 25th in 2013, so July 23rd/24th-ish, probably a weekend, so Sunday, July 21st? But I'm not good on this, I don't really know anything about Little League.

CirUmeUela wrote: <p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Punisher 2.04: Scar Tissue 52:00-54:38

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">July 2017?

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Billy shows his newly decorated mask to Dr. Dumont, he talks about his time serving Probably about a week after the previous appointment we were shown I guess, so around July 30, 2017?

CirUmeUela wrote: <p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Punisher 2.07: One Bad Day 0:00-6:08

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">December 2016

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Agent Madani is interviewed shortly after being shot by Billy Russo I'm thinking very early January 2017 for this, since it's "one year ago" from May 2018. I don't think it's a stretch to assume that after being shot in the head, she'd still be in hospital a couple of weeks later, and Marion says that Frank's liberty relies on her helping the cover-up, suggesting this is indeed after the end of Season 1, with Frank having been given his liberty.

CirUmeUela wrote: <p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Punisher 2.10: The Dark Hearts of Men 0:00-2:08

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">2010?, Before Kandahar assassination?

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Frank and Billy do a game of running down the line with their military friends I think you might not be aware of the recent changes/corrections to the The Punisher: Season 1 flashbacks - Kandahar is now 2013-2014. Sorry for any inconvenience, there was some discussion on here about why.

I don't really know with this scene. It's possible it's the Cerberus Squad I guess, but it all seems a bit too cheery. I would say it's more likely it's their previous deployment together, which we've estimated on the draft page as April 2011-June 2012, so around the middle of that deployment, November 2011? Or is it an exercise/game done in training, not during deployment?

CirUmeUela wrote: <p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Punisher 2.10: The Dark Hearts of Men 24:34-26:30

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">2010? Maybe when they were recently married, when the kids were very young?

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">John aka Pilgrim tells his wife his real name, she tells him to come home (Could be partly hallucination and not entirely a memory) Considering how devout a Christian Rebecca is, and John has (sort of) become, I can't imagine they conceived their children before marriage. Zell Steele Morrow (Michael) was born December 9, 2006, making him 11y5m old at the middle of filming on May 20, 2018. Since the middle of the season is set pretty much then, don't really need to do much calculating, that would suggest Michael was born around November/December 2006. Henry Boshart (Lemuel) looks younger so it doesn't matter that I can't find his date of birth. So, if their oldest child was born around November/December 2006, they were probably married by March 2006.

However, they say in a later episode that John left his white supremacist group and joined Christianity 12 years ago, so around mid-2006, maybe early 2006. If he met Rebecca quickly and they got married quickly, I still can't see them getting married until at least early 2007. So married early-to-mid-2007? With Michael then born late 2007, making him about a year younger than the actor portraying him, which is fairly standard.

CirUmeUela wrote: <p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Punisher 2.11: The Abyss 39:15-39:50 | 2.12: Collision Course 46:30-46:40

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:700;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">1990? She looks about 8 years old, the actress is 37

<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt;"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:#ffffff;background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre;white-space:pre-wrap;">Krista Dumont’s father jumps out the window with her in his arms, he dies but she lives with severe injuries Good guess, the actress, Reagan Grella, was 8 - she was born February 19, 2010, and the middle of filming was May 20, 2018, so she was approximately 8y3m old. However, in Episode 9, Krista says she was 9. So doing my usual calculations for this sort of thing, Krista was about [3469.875*(1500/365.25)+3012*(4/(3012/365.25))]/[(1500/365.25)+(4/(3012/365.25))] = 3422 days old, 9y4.4m. Floriana Lima was born March 26, 1981 and it looks like the middle of the season is probably set around May 10th-ish, so about 10 days before the middle of filming, so we just need to subtract 10 days, Krista's date of birth would be approximately March 16, 1981. So that would make it roughly 1990 as you say, late July 1990 as a best estimate, give or take only a few days depending on the exact placement of Season 2 in May 2018.

Kandahar (Marvelus)
Marvelus wrote: In Daredevil S2 when Schoonover is being interrogated in the court he says that Castle obtained a medal for his labour in the field 2 years ago, isn't this related to the Kandahar mission? Because they mentioned it too I think it's Karen saying it in Episode 5, not Schoonover in Episode 9. "Right, did you know that two years ago, Lieutenant Frank Castle was awarded the Navy Cross for his service in Afghanistan, right? That's second only to the Medal of Honor. This guy is a war hero." It's not necessarily about Kandahar, we know he served in Afghanistan multiple times, and actually I imagine if anything this supports Kandahar being 2013-2014 because I can't see him getting a Navy Cross after half-blinding his senior officer. So he was rewarded in late 2013, before he headed out to Kandahar, most likely for his 2011-2012 deployment that I calculated.

The Punisher: Season 2 (Marvelus)
Marvelus wrote: I liked the season, is not better than the first one but it has some highlight rhat the first one lacked as the improvement and flow of the plot. However, I hated every goddamn scene with Kirsta (Krysta?) I don't know and I don't care her name.

And I felt disgusted for the way they approached her traumas from her past and ugh... I just skipped all their emotional and sex scenes she had with Jigsaw. Which I liked so far but was expecting more of a threat to Castle and the others. There was not real opponent this season, just John Pilgrim who seems to have a pain tolerance upgraded to 100 just as Frank Castle. Damn. I wish I could take a beat and still get up and put up a good fight after a couple of days. The Punisher is a beast!

Whereas I can see that they have humanized the Punisher, he still likes killing people who deserve it. They might be in his 20s but that doesn't make them more innocent. People aged 14 kill a lot of people where I live, I know it has nothing to do with it but I am responding to BEJT's opinion of the season. Also, Punisher does like killing. He finally embraces after following closure and new activities. I definitely loved that last scene.

And I am so in love with Giorgia. She is so beautiful and talented! All her scenes with Punisher were great. And she is close to my age! Hell yeah!

My rating is 6.5 out of 10. Rewatching the Netflix Series I would rank it like this, though I liked it a lot the first season of Iron Fist, every time I rewatched I start to realize that it was not as good as it was the first time I watched. Not sucks nor is bad. But not the best one.


 * 1) Daredevil S3
 * 2) Daredevil S1
 * 3) Luke Cage S2
 * 4) The Punisher S1
 * 5) Jessica Jones S1
 * 6) Jessica Jones S2
 * 7) The Defenders
 * 8) The Punisher S2
 * 9) Iron Fist S2
 * 10) Luke Cage S1
 * 11) Iron Fist S1

He doesn't like killing, he's said before how he can do it but doesn't find it easy and only does it out of necessity. And the reason I had a problem with them being in their 20s was because Frank's wavering beliefs on whether or not people can be redeemed is very much called into question when they have their whole lives ahead of them to change, and also because at that age there is a good chance some of them have just been roped in and don't want to be there. Had it been a bunch of 50-year-olds trafficking women like the beginning of Daredevil: Season 1, sure. But a group of 20somethings with their whole lives ahead of them and potentially not all willing gang participants, only posing a threat to each other (it's not like it was made clear that Frank was preventing anything bad from happening here - we don't know what these groups would have done otherwise, all we are shown is that they would have killed each other. Frank's whole thing is that he doesn't take the risk of letting people live if they might just head back out and cause more harm, but for all we know, he stopped maybe 10 people dying... by just killing 15)? It felt gratuitous and poorly conceived for the sake of being "cool". You mention people aged 14 killing people, but that doesn't mean they deserve to die. Now sure, Frank's standard for "deserves to die" is a lot lower than mine, but I'm fairly sure that it would have to be incredibly low for anyone to think it's OK to kill a 14-year-old who killed someone. I can't see Frank ever killing a 14-year-old for having killed someone, because it's not just about the level of guilt, but the potential they have left in their lives for redemption and change. Anyway, just my feelings on that final scene, I didn't like it at all.

Krista is ridiculous. She would not be and should not have been hired for her profession with her mental state, and her route to suddenly being willing to set up people's deaths for Billy is unbelievable. Billy is a child. Emotionally, he has been reduced to a child, and she falls in love with him that much? I get the whole thing where they bond over their numbness and desire for pain, but when you take on a profession like hers you have to be of the state of mind that you could never fall in love with your patient like that, and especially Billy, who in no way during their time together was in any way desirable and is vulnerable. Her whole thing was just so wrong. Poor Floriana Lima, her Supergirl character was really bad as well - she was incredibly controlling in her relationship and self-centred, not caring about her girlfriend's feelings anywhere near enough.

You have a crush on a lot of MCU women, Marvelus😂. Fun fact about Giorgia though, she's Chief Dooley's (actor's) daughter.

You missed Daredevil: Season 2 on your ranking. I've said before personally I think you're a bit too harsh on Luke Cage: Season 1, but hey, your opinion is your opinion and you loved Season 2. And I can't personally get much enjoyment from Jessica Jones: Season 2, but I'm glad you did.

Ant-Man and the Wasp Past Dates (Cornstomper, Mrmichaelt)
Cornstomper wrote: One thing that still bugs me, is that no one's been able to place the Ghost flashbacks in Ant Man and The Wasp yet. I mean, I guess ideally somewhere in the 80s, but I don't have anywhere concrete to put it in my chronological cut. Sorry if you were waiting, just mention this stuff if you're waiting on us. This was calculated a few months ago - the first part was here, then the approximate conclusion here, May 1996, until I have the time to work it out exactly and write it up (sorry, I'm bogged down with stuff to do on the wiki, it's on my list and I'll get to it soon).

Unless you're referring to the stuff with her working for S.H.I.E.L.D.. That wasn't considered so urgent because it's footage, not flashbacks, so just needs placing once things are written up. I don't really know there, it has to be before 2014, presumably not too much before though, considering Hannah John-Kamen's age it could only be really for a few years before then.

Mrmichaelt wrote: Which part, the Argentina accident that killed her parents or when she was used by SHIELD? I take it she's about 28 years old. Probably 8 years old during the incident, so my guess is it's 1998. In that night vision POV of Ghost coming toward the soldier, she looks about the same she does in the present. So maybe age 20 give or take so like 2010. Come to think of, would that night vision POV or gun that soldier has date which generation of tech that is they're using? EDIT: I guess Fury found her too mentally unstable to be part of the Avengers Initiative. We went with 1996 for the reasons about.

Yeah, I'll have to rewatch Ant-Man and the Wasp when I get to writing up the past events to work out about her time with S.H.I.E.L.D.. I don't know about tech, good idea, that's potentially a factor.

I wonder how much Fury knew about her, since if I remember correctly, wasn't it implied that the group leading her were more of the Hydra portion of S.H.I.E.L.D.?

The Write-Up Discussion Thread (additional)
Just a reminder in case anyone interested missed it.